DISCLOSURE / FILE
Apollo 17 Crew Reports Cosmic-Ray Light Flashes
Segment 2 of 2 of the Apollo 17 post-mission medical debriefing at NASA's Manned Spacecraft Center in Houston, covering crew discussion of the cosmic-ray 'light flash phenomena.'
DISCLOSURE / FILE
Segment 2 of 2 of the Apollo 17 post-mission medical debriefing at NASA's Manned Spacecraft Center in Houston, covering crew discussion of the cosmic-ray 'light flash phenomena.'
NASA-UAP-D029, Apollo 17 Crew Medical Debriefing (Continued), 1972
Segment 2 of 2 of the Apollo 17 post-mission medical debriefing at NASA's Manned Spacecraft Center in Houston, covering crew discussion of the cosmic-ray 'light flash phenomena.'
This NASA file is the second of two segments of the Apollo 17 crew medical debriefing conducted at the Manned Spacecraft Center (now Johnson Space Center) in Houston, Texas, on December 21, 1972. Crew members and debriefers discuss the 'light flash phenomena,' the perception of light streaks caused by high-energy cosmic rays passing through the eye and striking the retina. Two of the three crew members reported observing the flashes at multiple points in the mission, including in lunar orbit and on the lunar surface. The source is image-only, so no verbatim page text is available for quotation.
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Okay, this is take number 14, tenuation of section 23.0 with Jack Schmidt.
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Okay, this is take number 14, tenuation of section 23.0 with Jack Schmidt.
Okay, flight data file, CSM.
Generally I have nothing but praise for the flight data file, both vehicles.
There was very, very few things that one could have asked for to improve that data file for
Apollo 17 at any rate.
One comment on the flight plan supplement.
We had split pages for a number of the logging, medical and food logging, and that probably
was a mistake.
I think the idea was fairly good initially, but the pages, we tended to only use that
in the book as a whole and it was a good place to keep them and also the pages, if you had
wanted them split, were too thin to maintain the split and they tended to fall out of the
book.
I recommend either not splitting or having heavier paper if you want them split.
We had an extra cue card built for panel 229.
I think it was an excellent card that summarized the circuit breaker functions both on 229
and on Panel 8 because we had no systems and anomalies of any significance that would
relate to that card, it was not used, but I would strongly recommend its availability
if only for training during the and during SIMS.
That's a good quick review of what you lose or retain for those two panels.
I, in the flight plan, I added some penic cues along the margins for certain observational
targets that I particularly wanted to look at.
These were independent of any experiment, designated experiment, and I entered them as
a function of time and that seemed to work very well for me.
I think it had that kind of thing as an individual preference item and if you have experimented
ought to be flight planned, if you're just planning to use your spare time for specific
observational targets or types of observations, then I think the penic is maybe the easiest
way to go since it shouldn't concern any large number of people.
We, Gordy Fullerton, fixed up the circular orbital cue card for me with a similar designation
of craters as a function of time, I did not use that, not because it wasn't a good idea,
but because a familiarity with the moon which came very quickly after a couple orbits and
you just, you could recognize your position on the moon fairly easily as a function of
each rev, either the time in the rev, approximate time since sunset, or just because you could
look out the window and tell where you were.
In the limb, we, the same comment supply, I think all the flight data file items were
excellent.
The, I did not use the data card book to the extent that I know it was used on 15 and maybe
on 16.
We logged most of our specific items such as alignment data and comparable kinds of things
in the checklist at the point where they were collected rather than in the data book and
had no, this did not seem to raise any difficulty at any time.
The cuff checklist we've talked about, I think, in the surface items, I, I thought the cuff
checklist was excellent, I think we did the things, we had the right kind of photo maps
in there that were useful for reference, where we were around a given station.
I don't think we used them as much as I had anticipated using them, mainly because navigation
was no problem and the points that we had selected pre-flight were excellent points
for investigation and there was no need to try to decide on alternative points to, to
try to study in the vicinity of a given station.
The list of items to be accomplished at each station are to, really, they were mine joggers
to read at each station, were not, again, not as used as much as I thought they would
be initially, but I think that was mainly because we both, at least I had become so familiar
with the items that each station was in itself easy to recall as a result of having created
the checklist, so checklist was, it turned out to be more of a, of a learning item rather
than a reference item for use on the surface, I wouldn't have done it any differently however.
I particularly want to compliment the Chuck Lewis on the timeline book that, but I really
can't sing on it, but the timeline book was, was very, very well done and very, had no
problems with the timeline book at all, but that of course applies to the, to every, every
checklist that we had, there were just no procedural errors that I could, that I recall
in any of the books that we used, fortunately we didn't have to use an malfunction book or
the only once did I pull out the systems data book to check, to check on a systems problem
and I, right now, can't remember what that was, I don't remember where it was, or I didn't
use it once. Charts and maps, I thought in the CSM that I would use the orbit, what do
I see, orbit monitor charts, I guess that's what they're called, and I had an extra one
put on, so I wouldn't interfere with the planned activities of, of the CMP, I did not use that
very much. I eventually did some sketching on it post TEI, I think there are about five
specific points that I labeled as areas, A, B, C, D, maybe E, and these are referenced
on my crew notebook, in my crew notebook for specific observations, but in general I did
not put that to as much use as I expected. One item is that, that chart should have been
identical to the CMP's chart, and there were a few pen and ink changes left off of it that
caused some confusion at one point. Pen and ink exposure settings for certain photo targets.
The CSM, the landmark maps that the LNP had added in the rear of that book, again were
not used. I really thought I would use those, but in the, you became reluctant as you were
observing a specific point or area target, such as Gagarin or something like that, to
take time out, to sketch on the photo. I tended for the two or three minutes that observation
was possible of a given area. I tended to look, and then at the first opportunity to
take notes in the notebook, rather than trying to sketch on the photograph. And I suspect
that this was because I tended to look for generalizations about the target that I was
trying to observe, rather than checking out specific individual features. And there really
did not seem to be any need to make notes about specific points on the pictures, and
as a result I did not use them. Again, though, I think having selected them and
study them pre-flight made it worth having them around. The necessity for flying them
was probably less than the necessity for having reviewed them and study them. I think I still,
if I had to do it again, I still would want to have that kind of data available in the
spacecraft, even though on this particular mission it was not used. I do think though
that the CMP used his visual target maps considerably, and I did on a couple occasions
to use some of the ones that he had again. But for the most part that was post-TEI, and
I made some notes and sketches on some of those maps. And I think that was just a function
that there was a lot of time to look at the moon and make a sketch and then look back
and fix it up post-TEI, where in orbit the time just did not exist. As Dick Gordon said
a couple of years ago, and once you start flying, the clock is relentless. Okay, General
Flight Planning. I was not very closely involved in the flight planning. Ron sort of carried
the burden of that for both Jean and myself. The flight plan was excellent. We had no problems
with it at all, that I'm aware of. Tommy Holloway and his people were to be complimented on that.
A number of different requirements and experiments and general operational items that were required
to be integrated one with the other was very, very high, and it was done in an extremely
competent and usable way. And I can't think of anything that I would change in the way
the flight plan was written. Okay, 23.5 pre-flight support. Pre-flight support was excellent in
the flight data file area. And one specific item that I had was once the flight plan was
well established, just about at the final stage. I had two or three, I don't remember,
two or three briefing sessions were in the portions of the moon orbit flight plan that
I was going to be during which I was going to be in the spacecraft and the CSM. We went
over in detail the attitudes and maneuvers and the window of availability so that I was
able to plan in a very short amount of time with the minimum effort on my part, my own
personal observations of the lunar surface and which went very well as far as planning
was concerned. Appreciated that that was extra above and beyond the call of duty on the part
of the flight planers and I appreciated their taking time out to do that for me. I think
it was useful to have the, I think it was a day-long session where the flight controllers
and the crew and the flight planners sat around in one room and went over those portions
of the flight plan which were not normally simulated. It turned out that the flight plan
had been so well done that I doubt if there were any specific items that came up that
we needed to do change or there seemed to be a lack of coordination on. This was in
contrast to previous flights where I think we were still learning, all of us were learning
on how to put together flight plans in a great requirement. The Apollo 17 flight plan apparently
reached the peak of perfection. I was a little bit disappointed in that briefing in that
some of the people who would be eventually intimately involved in the mission were not
at the flight plan review and I think this was because of conflicts with other programs
which were the center I was carrying out at the time. Okay, 24.0 visual sightings. Well,
we've covered the countdown and launch, I think, pretty well in the previous sections.
Also part flight, Earth orbit, I think the transcript would cover the visual sightings
that I made with respect to weather and a few geographic observations and that same
would go for the fairly extensive weather observations that I tried to make, or translunar. We had
only a small crescent of an Earth and it was not feasible to do an extensive weather observations.
I don't know whether I recorded yet that although we had light flashes just about continuously
during the whole flight when it was when you were dark adapted and I may have even had
one which I thought was a flash on the lunar surface during the first rev, that one period
of time when we had the blindfolds on for the opnet experiment there just were no visible
flashes although the next that evening that night before I went to sleep I noticed I was
seeing the light flashes again so it just seemed to be that one interval either side
of that, that interval and either side of it where the light flash phenomena was not visible
to myself or to the other two crewmen.
Lunar orbit, I think the transcript and my crew notebook would cover all of the visual
sightings that I can remember at this stage without going over it by orbit and feature
by feature with the photography and I think that has to come later.
Entry we covered in the previous briefings and I think the same goes for landing and
recovery. 25.0, pre-mission planning for the LNP, it's hard to think of once again of
anything that we didn't do right, I'm sure that might have been different had we had
problems on the flight but right the way the flight went, the total plan, the integration
of the mission requirements into that plan, although there were periods of some difficulty
pre-flight particularly in the area of medical requirements and in some last minute possible
scientific requirements particularly on the samples, everything seemed to get resolved
satisfactorily as near as I could tell and I don't, I can't think of anything that was
not handled very well and particularly between the people who were leveling the requirements
and the flight planners in particular and occasionally when the crew had to be involved
that was handled almost entirely by the support crew, Bob Parker in the science area and Gordy
Fullerton and Bob Obermeyer in the operational areas. There were no significant spacecraft
changes in the course of our training period. Ron I guess the biggest single area that took
time was the one that Ron had to deal with and that was Luna Sounder. Most of our ALSEP
changes were all taken care of prior to our training and we had a few minor suggestions
that were taken care of early in the training cycle and we essentially had an up-to-date
to ALSEP to train with and all other lunar surface gear was up to date for most of the
12-month training period or the final 12 months of the training period. Mission rules and
techniques were fairly well defined very early by Phil Schaeffer and his crowd in the techniques
area and the mission rules and Jerry Griffin and people working on that. No major changes
and only the only changes were all I felt in the right direction and that they enhanced
the probability of making a landing and a successful mission. They generally were in
the area of opening up possibilities for workarounds so that a mission could be completed.
We really never had to exercise any significant, any of the mission rules in that normal way.
I think the one time that mission rule tended to, at least finish this check on everyone,
a mission rule tended to be fairly clearly a controlling factor was in the limitation
on the work at Station 4 or Shorty Crater where we were up against the walk-back constraints
and terminated that work after only 35 minutes where another 30 minutes there I think would
have been extremely valuable although I hope that we got enough information that the phenomenon
exposed at that crater can be understood. The 26.0 mission control, typically outstanding
support for mission control. I think this includes the number of extracurricular hours
that the limb people and the e-cons for the CSM in particular put in with me on Saturdays
and other times just generally talking over systems and techniques, mission rules and
that was a major factor in helping me understand and keep up to speed on those items. I think
the help that they gave me in designing and in fact as they essentially did it, they did
the design of the emergency cue cards that we did for Apollo 17 for the limb was a major
contribution although fortunately not, we did not use them, they still made it possible
to understand very quickly systems problems and to solve those problems in the simulations
and had we required them, I think it would have gone very well. I particularly want to
point out the help that Dick Thorson gave in organizing most of the limb sessions and
even some of the joint CSM limb sessions that we had. And he also, Thorson also was a major
organizer of the creation of and the updating of Bill's emergency cue cards. Human factor
is 27.0. Let's go back, let's say one other comment on 26.0. Post flight, it's my understanding
that some of the things I had hoped could be done during the flight were not possible
because of real time discussions in the mission control. Specifically one of those things
was to have some summary of the thinking of the science background given to me while
in flight and that would be the thinking based on the data that we had transmitted to them
verbally and to sense visually through the television camera. I had hoped that I would
have the benefit of their thinking but apparently this was not possible to do. I would like
to think that in the future we can look at ways of using the team approach to science
investigations in space rather than depending solely on the observational capability and
the interpretive capability of the men who are performing the job. There's no reason
that I can see to not use all the brain power that's available for any given task and part
of that brain power is on the ground. Okay 27.0. Human factor is preflight. The broad
of the discussions and organization from the crew point of view of the preflight health
stabilization control program was born by the commander and the LNP just sort of went
along with whatever was decided. I personally did not find any great difficulty in working
out and adhering to the requirements of that program. I think medical care although very
limited requirement was good. A couple of sinus infections I had reacted just like they
always had and we were able over a period of two or ten days or two weeks to get those
cleared up. Time for exercise probably was less than it should have been although I was
able to get a good workout just about every other day. In addition to the workouts we
got as a normal course of our UVA training. Eventually text started scheduling putting
on the schedule time in the late afternoon for exercise and that helped as a reminder
and and buffer to see that that exercise was obtained. It is generally hard and at least
in the lunar training program to get exercise periods in during the day and quite frequently
the exercise was done in the Cape Gym at night. I think rest and sleep is an individual thing
and I made a particular effort to always get as much as I possibly could and try never
to get behind the park or on rest because my personal experiences with that is when I
tend to get cold and resulting sinus infections. Medical briefing was good. The exams seemed
to go very well in my estimation. They were as expeditious as possible under the circumstances
and I think the operational medical personnel who carried out the exams are to be complemented
in their efforts to see that the exam was as painless and as efficient as possible. This
should also include the post-flight exams on the Ticonderoga. Eating habits and amount
of food consumption were normal except during those periods of time when we were on the
end flight food prior to launch and those times that tended to be in my case a decrease
of appetite and certainly although the food was certainly a powerable my appetite did
go down and it certainly was not possible for me to eat the amount of food that was provided
for me. This also applied to space work but in the case of the in-flight eating although
I did not eat everything that was available to me in my food packages I apparently should
needed to if I hadn't wanted to avoid losing weight. My appetite was down but also apparently
for some reason I had a loss of weight and at this time of this recording my weight is
still down has not gone up to the pre-flight levels which may have been a little high by
the way. Okay 17.2 flight appetite food preference well I just discussed that a little bit and
the appetite in flight versus to each pre-flight was less again except for when we were testing
the pre-flight food when I also had a low appetite. No notable differences in the taste
of food I think the things I like pre-flight I liked in space and the things I didn't like
I also didn't like I didn't notice any differences. Changing food preferences of flight progressed
I tended to start to prefer to eat the wet packs and would eat those in preference to
any of the other solid foods. I would strongly recommend my personal point of view at any
rate that food that the wet packs be used in preference to the rehydratable. I know I
think that probably you get a different opinion from the other crewmen. The juices were good
I after the first period of one and only a period of difficulty with loose bowel moments
I did cut out the potassium indicated foods and although I can't say whether that had
any effect or not but I would not have any other loose I did not have any other bowel
moments and certainly no more loose ones. Before the end of the flight the first bowel
moment after flight on the ticonderoga was normal the second was very loose the third
was normal and the fourth and fifth very loose.
The size of food portions and the meal portions of course were pretty much constant in terms
of availability packaging but my appetite was very low the first day and gradually increased
over the next two or three days and remained essentially the same after about the third
day. I mentioned the most acceptable foods were the wet packs and the juices. The food
cake I thought was good although it was possible to eat too much or to get to the point where
you didn't want anymore. The chocolate was good I think of the dry crackers or cookies
of graham crackers were probably the most tasty. And the peanut butter and jelly sandwiches
were quite good. Deviations from the menu and the eat periods are all recorded in the
light transcripts I'm sure. Okay food preparation and consumption.
Rehydration went I think normally and the normal gas was present. Food temperature tended
to prefer the foods that were warm or hot and they were the hot water was quite adequate
for warm foods. We actually I think missed the warm foods considerably in the limb where
that hot water was not available. I did not notice an effect of water flavor water was
reasonably tasty. I never noticed a high chlorine taste of any kind. Oh the gas content did
make it a little bit uncomfortable to eat at times. Boom bowl packages worked pretty
well although those that were finally divided I tended to cut off the other end of the package
the water insertion in and use them as a squeeze package. Spoons work perfectly adequate.
I tended not to use the fruit in the cans because of just the messiness of opening those
although there I think the technique that Ron worked out of opening it in your inner near
your mouth is a good one. Puddings and this kind of thing were very good. It was only
the fruits the canned fruits that I tended to avoid just because they were inconvenient
to use. Food bars during EVAs I think were good to have although I never ate more than
half of one. It was not because it was untastied just because of a maybe a lack of interest
in eating and using that time during the EVAs. We I think after the EVA before and after
EVAs and the limb ate very well. There were some things though we did not that we avoided
and I guess in my case after one having corn chowder once and that's stimulating a major
album it although not a loose one. I tended not I did not eat corn chowder. I did not
eat the cocoa because I tended to feel like I got a little more gassed from cocoa and after
taste I did not eat the shrimp or the seafood item shrimp and the lobster bisque and these
sort of things because of the pre-flight I had noticed that they tended to have a long
aftertaste. But otherwise I think all the other foods were certainly acceptable although
many times I did not eat potato based foods because of just they were very filling.
I don't know how the German side old tablet worked. The pouch was okay. Would have been
nice to have a little dispenser that was easier to use than the pouch. I don't know whether
that would be possible to do or not. It seems to me it would a little tube dispenser of some
kind where they came out more easily. We generally just cut the corner off the pouch and squeezed
them out but it was a little inconvenient, nothing major. We used the German saddle tablets.
I did any right in all the juice bags and the spoon bowl bags and the wet packs. I did
not use them in the tea and coffee. Unders are the holders really except for the passion
of gas occasionally by the other crewmen and occasionally by myself. Unders are the owners
of the minimum. I did not find that the atmosphere was unpleasant as a general rule. I might
say that I generally had a continuous, almost continuous passage of gas most of which apparently
was not of significant odor. Occasionally that seemed to be objectionable to the other crewmen.
I think most of that was the water gas and the reason I think that is that upon starting
to eat there would be an increased desire to pass gas, an increased pressure in my stomach
apparently was transmitted almost immediately into the bowels. After eating it would pass
gas for a couple hours to three hours. Just before eating the next time the desire would
have pretty well dissipated and then it would start immediately upon eating. Before any
digestion was possible I am sure, so I suspect water gas was the main culprit in the LNP's
gas problems which were not significant. Quantity of food eaten on the lunar surface I think
was high although probably no more than half of that food that was available. It is hard
to say exactly and I think that could be worked out maybe with a detailed look at the menus
if that is desirable. To estimate the quantity would be very difficult. The quantity of food
discarded on the lunar surface would be difficult without looking at the detailed menus and
checking off those items that I am sure we ate that I ate at any rate. Skylab fecal container.
I don't know if we have that. We use a blue bag. The blue bag is not a bad way to defecate
unless the stool is loose. If it is loose it is just about impossible to use. I don't
know what you do. It is your gravity for loose stool. I don't know of any clever way to prevent
that being a problem and I am not even sure whatever the skylab people are using will prevent
that from being a problem. The best thing you can do is to work out prevention of loose
stools rather than trying to handle them after you get them. A loose stool is one of the
major hygiene and sanitary and operational problems that you can have on a flight. I
can't emphasize that more. If it happened on a regular basis, on a daily basis, you would
think eventually cut the efficiency of the crew member with the problem by a significant
percentage possibly as much as 30% depending on the magnitude of the problem. It is important
to try to understand why Apollo 17 was different than 16 and at least in the delay of a problem
of loose stools until about the 11th or 12th day and in the case of the commander, no problem
of loose stools and my personal opinion at this point based on very little information
other than observation in flight and thinking about levels of electrolyte intake is that
with the electrolyte quantity down from that imposed on Apollo 16 that we did not reach
the electrolyte saturation level until the 11th or 12th day in terms of this CMP and the
LMP and in terms of the commander because his electrolyte intake was generally less I
think and that can be documented. He did not reach the saturation level at all and when
that saturation level was reached however in the case of the CMP and LMP I suspect that
the electrolytes we were eating were dumped in a sense or concentrated in the intestines
and tended to act pretty much as a laxity and as an absence of type laxity if you will
in concentrated water in the stool. I think it's important for Skylab that first of all
we probably reduced the electrolyte intake so that saturation is never reached and secondly
that if loose stool problem develops it appears to be an electrolyte problem other than any
other biological problem that we decrease the intake of electrolytes this is what I did
on my own and whether or not it worked or not it's hard to say because the flight was
terminated before any other stools occurred okay water, orientation odor was not apparent
to me except during chlorination, identification odor is very slight apparent in the limb water
but not any significance to the LMP, physical discomfort, no physical discomfort for the
LMP other than tiredness on occasion and in the case of the EVA work sore muscles and
the bruises under the fingernails, gas water separator didn't work very effectively and
I'm sure that's been discussed elsewhere. Tensity of thirst or intermission never really
thirsty, extensively thirsty even during the EVAs although I did stop to take a drink
of water occasionally but I never drunk, I never drank all the water in the in-flight
drink bag and suit drink bag. Work rest and sleep okay, hey Tex could you try to call
the call the trailer was I, work rest sleep for the LMP, okay the difficulty in going
to sleep was variable and when seeking all was used generally no difficulty in going
to sleep when it was not used I guess there was a tendency to stay awake a little bit
longer but on other occasions the after seeking all did not seem to affect the rate of going
to sleep. There was a tendency on a couple on several nights to go to sleep and then
wake up fairly soon after going to sleep within an hour and then the second time took
a little bit of not maybe sometimes took up to an hour to go back to sleep but I feel
that the medical law reports that for the LMP were generally valid that a probably average
of five and a half to six hours of sleep per night was good and I don't think except
for maybe one night somewhere in there did I go much below that but the sleep was rarely
continued probably never continuous for more than three hours without waking up. I feel
that six hours is adequate sleep for the kind of work we were doing in space however the
programming of eight hours is necessary in order to get six hours because of the periods
of wakefulness when during sleep periods and for just the difficulty in getting the cabin
organized and everybody to bed at the prime program time. So maintaining an eight hour
sleep period is I think mandatory in order to obtain the six hours that is probably
all that is required to perform the mission without getting tired or getting behind the
power curve as I say with respect to sleep. Restraints I had the feeling that to find
by the way. I had the feeling that I wanted to have my head and limbs restrained in order
to get a good sleep although I did sleep at times without without that restraint. If I
were rebuilding the sleep restraints for my personal use I would make them smaller with
a somewhat more feeling of restraint. They're a little bit large I would say for use. When
I slept in the couch I tended to put a shoulder strap over my head and sent you down very
lightly so that I had that feeling of head restraint. Probably the biggest two things
that made sleep difficult when it was difficult was the loss of sensory perception of limb
position in zero gravity when they were not being moved that perception came back immediately
upon moving them but when they were just static and in a rest position they tended to be for
the LNP at any rate a loss of sensory perception of the position of the limb.